Episode 10
S3 Bonus Episode: The God Who Meets With Us—Introducing Encounter 🙌
Can you really encounter the living God today—or was that just for Bible times? In this special bonus episode, Becky and Zer sit down with our lead pastor, Jason Paredes, to talk about Encounter—a brand-new Wednesday night gathering designed for one purpose: to meet with God.
Jason unpacks a mind-blowing theory about Moses, Elijah, and the Transfiguration that reveals how God stands outside of space and time—and why that truth changes how we meet Him right now. Together, they explore how God still invites His people to experience His presence, not just learn about it.
39:33 - Listen to the @CareyNieuwhof Revival Series here
Watch the full sermon from Sunday, October 5th, on our YouTube Channel
They tackle deep questions:
🔥 What does it actually mean to “encounter” God?
🔥 How is Encounter different from a prayer gathering?
🔥 Can anyone really experience God’s presence—or only the “spiritual”?
🔥 Why does confession matter before worship?
🔥 How do we prepare our hearts to meet with a holy God?
Whether you’ve walked with Jesus for decades or feel too far gone to start, this episode will remind you that God still says, “Come meet with Me.”
📖 Scriptures Mentioned:
Matthew 17 — The Transfiguration
Exodus 19 & 34 — Moses on Mount Sinai
1 Kings 19 — Elijah’s encounter on Mount Horeb
Zechariah 12:10 — “They will look upon the one they have pierced”
💡 Key Takeaways:
✨ God is still inviting His people to encounter Him.
✨ Confession prepares your heart for His presence.
✨ You don’t have to be “good at prayer”—you just have to show up.
✨ The same God who met Moses and Elijah wants to meet with you.
🕊️ Encounter is every Wednesday at 6:30pm at our Pioneer Campus (2011 S. Fielder Rd, Arlington, TX 76012). Come hungry for His presence.
📺 Watch this episode on YouTube
🌐 Learn more: fielder.org/podcast
💬 Got a topic suggestion? Let us know at fielder.org/podcast
📲 Follow us: @fielderpodcast
Takeaways:
- The episode emphasizes the importance of encountering God and how it can profoundly transform one's life and perspective.
- Listeners are encouraged to approach God with openness and humility, recognizing their own brokenness and need for forgiveness.
- The speakers discuss the significance of Scripture and how understanding its entirety can enhance one's spiritual journey and connection with God.
- A central theme of the episode is that God invites the broken and weary to come to Him, assuring that no one is too far gone to seek His grace.
Transcript
Hey, everyone, this is Becky and some of you guys.
Speaker A:This might be your first time visiting us, but I'm joined by Zur and we are the podcast and we just like to sit here and facilitate discussion on certain topics.
Speaker A:And we are joined today by our lead pastor, Jason Paredes.
Speaker A:Yeah, and now this is a special situation because normally, like me and Zur and Marty, we approach people whenever we have certain topics in mind.
Speaker A:But past Pastor Jason actually requested this episode and we'll get a little bit more into that of why he wanted to talk about this.
Speaker B:It's mainly because y' all would never ask where he was at such a wee.
Speaker B:Pick me, pick me.
Speaker A:But yeah.
Speaker A:So, like, again, if this is your first time joining us, we're so happy that you're here.
Speaker A:We hope you continue to come back for any future and previous episodes.
Speaker A:But if you have not listened.
Speaker A:Disclaimer.
Speaker A:If you have not listened to the sermon and the message from October 5th, aka yesterday in you have not listened to that, please go back and listen to that.
Speaker A:Because this discussion is meant to supplement that sermon.
Speaker A:And so we want to, you know, set you up for success and understanding and following us.
Speaker A:And so please, we're going to link that in the description below.
Speaker A:Please go and watch that.
Speaker A:That being said, I just want to kick us off by asking you, why did you want to talk about this today?
Speaker B:Yeah, it's a good question.
Speaker B:I'm wondering that myself by now.
Speaker B:No, it really came from as I was preparing the sermon and what I was going to share, there was just an aspect of the passage that I thought was so incredibly important.
Speaker B:And as I was praying through what I wanted to share about the Lord saying, not in the sermon, I have a different goal.
Speaker B:But this truth was one of those, like, mind blowing things that I thought, the church needs to hear this.
Speaker B:So what's the best forum for the church to dig in and see the power of the word of God and the nuances that are in there?
Speaker B:And I thought maybe podcast might be the best place to do that.
Speaker B:So I said, hey there, Becky.
Speaker B:Here's her.
Speaker B:And y' all were gracious to let us do this.
Speaker A:So it's been really fun to kind of think through this and talk about it.
Speaker A:And again, like, hearing the message too, it just kind of gets your brain going on it.
Speaker A:And I don't know, like, what were your thoughts as you were, like, reading through and listening to it?
Speaker C:I mean, what I love is you do such a great job in communicating what you need to communicate, but I know just the vastness of study.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker C:That you have.
Speaker C:And so honestly, I'm so grateful that you decided to reach out and say, hey, there's just so much in here that I want.
Speaker C:Not just, you know, the field of church, but who would.
Speaker C:Whoever would listen, like the vastness of what God has for us in his scripture.
Speaker C:So I'm just, honestly, I'm just excited for.
Speaker C:To hear more about that.
Speaker B:Because you're a Bible nerd.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker B:Come on.
Speaker C:You're like that kind of thing.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:So for all of us non Bible freaks, you're one too.
Speaker A:I know, I know, I know.
Speaker A:But yeah, I mean, there was a lot of scriptures that we've been talking through and that you had mentioned that part of it.
Speaker A:And so just to kind of ask like, if you could share kind of first of all, like, kind of as.
Speaker A:Share the theory that we, We've talked a lot about that, but the just the theory that you referenced in the message, but also some of the scripture that kind of not necessarily like just the scripture that you.
Speaker A:That got you thinking about that.
Speaker B:Yeah, well, I'm so cool.
Speaker B:I'm analog.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:Sorry, sorry.
Speaker B:I'm gonna Google Matthew 17.
Speaker B:So the whole story was a transfiguration, an unbelievable moment, which I think is one of the most overlooked stories in the Bible because it's so amazingly significant.
Speaker B:They get to see who Jesus is when we focus in on the confession of Christ before by Peter in chapter 16, you are the Christ, the son of the living God.
Speaker B:And like, oh, great moment.
Speaker B:And then totally miss that.
Speaker B:The actual demonstration of who he is known as in chapter 17.
Speaker B:And so it talks about, they go up to a high mountain and he's transfigured before them, metamorphosized in front of them.
Speaker B:Face is shining, he's glowing, like the ancient of days.
Speaker B:And this is a small, little subtle comment.
Speaker B:And it said in verse three, and behold, there appear to them Moses and Elijah talking with him, and then just moves on, like nothing's happening.
Speaker A:Like that's normal.
Speaker A:They're very dead.
Speaker B:This is like hundreds and hundreds, if not thousand plus years long gone.
Speaker B:And yet they're hanging out with Jesus in this moment.
Speaker B:And you know, like, it doesn't say it as much over here, but in the other gospels it says like, Peter was like out of his mind, so confused.
Speaker B:He's like, I'm going to build a tabernacle, both three of you.
Speaker B:And I was studying it was basically him going like, I don't want this moment to end.
Speaker B:It's so Good.
Speaker B:I want Moses to stay here and Elijah to stay here and Jesus to stay here.
Speaker A:I relate to Peter and so much, and he's overwhelming and panic.
Speaker A:He's just not going to stop talking.
Speaker A:I'm like, just stop.
Speaker A:Just let it.
Speaker A:Let it happen.
Speaker B:But there's something like.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:I've read that.
Speaker B:Like, I don't know how many times I've read that.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I just repassed it.
Speaker B:Like, oh, that's cool.
Speaker B:You know, Moses and Elijah, anyways, never stopped.
Speaker B:Like, how did they get there?
Speaker B:Who's there?
Speaker B:What does that even look like?
Speaker B:And so that was really the springboard to make me go, what do I do with that?
Speaker B:I'm going to be preaching through the Gospel of Matthew.
Speaker B:And I had heard somebody lift up this theory that potentially this is where it gets a little bit.
Speaker B:A bit weird.
Speaker B:Y' all stop me and ask questions along the way if you want to, that maybe, like, you got to figure out, where did he come from, what's really going on here.
Speaker B:And I've heard some people, and I shared this in the message on Sunday who say, like, maybe.
Speaker B:Maybe they're just symbols.
Speaker B:Like, Moses is a symbol of the law and Elijah is a symbol of the prophets.
Speaker B:But I mean, it.
Speaker B:It says they were there talking with him.
Speaker B:Yeah, like, symbols don't talk.
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker B:Apparently there's somebody there.
Speaker B:Some would say, yeah, but they're dead, so it must be their spirit who comes up.
Speaker B:And granted, spirit.
Speaker B:Spirits in the Bible can talk.
Speaker B:The spirit of Samuel is conjured up by the witch in Endor, and Saul's able to.
Speaker B:And the spirit talks.
Speaker B:But I can't find a moment in the Bible where a spirit conjured up is a good thing.
Speaker B:And so that just seems to be.
Speaker B:And it doesn't say any.
Speaker B:Like, it says, clearly, that's the spirit of Samuel who's talking to Saul when you go back to First Kings.
Speaker B:But this doesn't seem to.
Speaker B:This doesn't seem to be a spirit.
Speaker B:It says they were there.
Speaker B:Moses and Elijah talked.
Speaker B:So here's the theory.
Speaker B:Kind of just drop it over there and then tell you why.
Speaker B:The theory is that when Moses went up to Mount Sinai and when Elijah went up to Mount Horeb and they're encountering God up there, because, you know, we'll talk about a minute.
Speaker B:But Moses goes up there and then he enters the cloud.
Speaker B:That's where he gets the Ten Commandments, and he's there with God, that he steps through space and time and enters this moment where he's meeting with Jesus, who now is revealed in his glory as the ancient of days.
Speaker B:So he goes up.
Speaker B:Moses goes up to the high mountain to meet with the ancient of days.
Speaker B:And here he is meeting with Jesus.
Speaker B:And then Elijah in 1 Kings 19, when he goes to meet, have an encounter with God, he says he goes up to Mount Horeb, and that's the whole.
Speaker B:Like, there was an earthquake and there was a fire and a strong wind, but he wasn't into those.
Speaker B:But he was in the still, small voice.
Speaker B:And God talks to him, but he's on top of Mount Horeb.
Speaker B:And the theory is that potentially when he went up to Mount Horeb, God in his infinite power, whisks him away from time and space and brings him to meet the ancient days at the top and has a conversation with him.
Speaker B:And at this moment, when Peter, James, and John are meeting with Jesus in his glorious form, Elijah and Moses are meeting with the glorious ancient of days at the exact same time.
Speaker B:And they're all converging, which, when I heard that, I was like, yeah, my brain's not working right after that one, which just really struck me.
Speaker B:And so then I began to go like, okay, that's a cool theory, but where is that in the Bible?
Speaker B:Because my first thought was like, but Moses went to Mount Sinai, and I didn't even know anything about Mount Horeb for Elijah.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:And that's not where they are, because Mount Sinai is in a totally different place.
Speaker B:You know, that's when they were wandering in the wilderness.
Speaker B:And Mount Horeb have no idea where that is.
Speaker B:And this is happening somewhere in the ancient area of Israel.
Speaker B:So it can't be the same mountain.
Speaker B:Does God work that way?
Speaker B:And so I went back and started looking.
Speaker B:And so if you go to Exodus.
Speaker A:Bible, drill on the pot, the verse just open up.
Speaker B:And this is really important for me.
Speaker B:I don't want you to, like, take my word for it.
Speaker B:I want to look at the word of God and see what it says.
Speaker B:So in Exodus 19 is when Israel is at the base of Mount Si and God is calling Moses up to go meet with him.
Speaker B:He's got to give all these caveats and rules, like, don't go up there, you're going to die.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And the people are like, I don't want to go up there.
Speaker B:Moses, you go for us.
Speaker B:But then you get to verse 16, and it says that on the morning of the third day, there were thunders and lightnings and a thick cloud on the mountain and a very LOUD trumpet blast.
Speaker B:So that all the people in the camp trembled.
Speaker B:Then Moses brought the people out of the camp to meet God, and they took their stand at the foot of the mountain.
Speaker B:And now Mount Sinai was wrapped in smoke.
Speaker B:That's going to be important because the Lord had descended on it in fire.
Speaker B:So there's like, light and fire and smoke altogether.
Speaker B:The smoke of it went up like the smoke of a kiln.
Speaker B:And the whole mountain trembled greatly.
Speaker B:So it's trembling.
Speaker B:There's smoke, there's light, there's fire.
Speaker B:Fire.
Speaker B:And as the sound of the trumpet grew louder and louder, Moses spoke and God answered him in thunder.
Speaker B:So now God is speaking in this thunderous voice.
Speaker B:And the Lord came down on Mount Sinai to the top of the mountain.
Speaker B:And the Lord called Moses at the top of the mount.
Speaker B:And Moses went up.
Speaker B:So, you know, you're going up there, and Moses is meeting with God, and there's smoke and there's fire and light and there's trembling, and there's a booming voice of God, okay, hold your place over there.
Speaker B:Go back to Matthew 17.
Speaker B:And it says, they, behold in verse three, there appeared to them, Moses and Elijah talking with him.
Speaker B:And Peter's freaking out, going, it's so good that we're here and we build these places for you.
Speaker B:In verse five, he was still speaking when, behold, a bright cloud.
Speaker B:So it's bright, like light overshadowed them.
Speaker B:And a voice, a thunderous voice from the cloud said, this is my beloved Son, with whom I'm well pleased.
Speaker B:Listen to him.
Speaker B:And it says, when the disciples heard this, they fell on their faces and were terrified.
Speaker B:So remarkably similar to the scene that you see in Exodus, where the people are terrified because there's this smoke and fire and trembling, and here's God meeting with them.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And so.
Speaker B:Okay, that's unusual.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Then you go over to 1 Kings, chapter 19, 1 Kings 19.
Speaker B:You have Elijah.
Speaker B:This is on the heels of the Mount Carmel moment, when the prophets of BAAL are defeated.
Speaker B:You got Elijah's in his, like.
Speaker B:I mean, he's just, like, brazen, calling down fire from.
Speaker B:Pour water on it.
Speaker B:And you see how good my God is.
Speaker B:Your God must be in the bathroom.
Speaker A:That story is hilarious.
Speaker B:It is.
Speaker B:He's hunting them, like, so much faith.
Speaker B:And he calls out fire.
Speaker B:And he's just like, they kill all the prophets of baal.
Speaker B:And you think it'd be a high moment.
Speaker B:And then Jezebel says, I'm coming for you.
Speaker B:And Elijah freaks out, and he goes and runs for his life, and he wants to Die.
Speaker B:And he's overwhelmed.
Speaker B:But as you get to chapter 19, it says that he's off and he's being fed by God.
Speaker B:The ravens are bringing food.
Speaker B:And the Lord says to him, arise and eat.
Speaker B:And verse six, then verse seven, that came a second time, touched him and said, arise and eat.
Speaker B:And then verse eight, I had never noticed this before.
Speaker B:And he arose and ate and drank and went in the strength of that food 40 days and 40 nights to Horeb, the Mount of Ga.
Speaker B:So he's at Horeb.
Speaker B:You go, okay.
Speaker B:What is.
Speaker B:What matters of Horeb?
Speaker B:Well, interesting little bit for you.
Speaker B:You can keep your place in 1 Kings 19, but if you were to go to Deuteronomy chapter 4, it tells the people that they're coming before God, and he calls it in this passage.
Speaker B:If you go to verse 15, he's talking about going up to meet God on the mountain.
Speaker B:Therefore, watch yourselves very carefully since you saw no form on the day that the Lord spoke to you at Horeb out of the midst of the fire.
Speaker B:Beware, lest you act corruptly by making a carved imagery.
Speaker B:So then he goes through.
Speaker B:He's talking about that moment when he met with God on the mountain.
Speaker B:He calls it Horeb.
Speaker B:If you were to go back earlier in verse nine, only take care and keep your soul diligently lest you forget the things that your eyes have seen and lest they depart from your heart all the days of your life, he says, make them known to your children and your children's children.
Speaker B:How on the day that you stood before the Lord, your God at Horeb, the Lord said to me, gather the people to me, that they may hear my words.
Speaker B:And he goes through the darkness, the gloom, the cloud.
Speaker B:And it's clearly the same experience that Moses had back in Exodus 19, but he calls it Mount Horeb.
Speaker B:Yeah, pretty striking.
Speaker B:Similar.
Speaker B:See, you got now, Elijah on Mount Horeb, and he has an encounter with God the same place that Moses had an encounter with God.
Speaker B:Now, if you come in here and you keep reading in First Kings 19.
Speaker B:So we're back now to the Elijah experience.
Speaker B:He's on Mount Horeb, the.
Speaker B:The Mount of God, it's called, which, you know, again, I don't know where that's at, but the Mount of God, verse 9, it says, There he came, talking about Elijah, to a cave and lodged in it.
Speaker B:And behold, the word of the Lord came to him, which, by the way, the word of the Lord.
Speaker B:If you go to the Gospel of John, chapter one.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God.
Speaker B:And the Word was God.
Speaker B:He was in the beginning with God.
Speaker B:All things were made through him.
Speaker B:Without him was not anything made that was made.
Speaker B:In him was life, and the life was the light of men.
Speaker B:He was talking about Jesus.
Speaker B:Yes, the Word of God, right?
Speaker B:So now here you got Elijah in verse nine, and it says, the word of the Lord came to him.
Speaker B:And he said to him, what are you doing here, Elijah?
Speaker B:Which I think is interesting that the Word of the Lord came to him and he spoke to him.
Speaker B:He's personified in this moment.
Speaker B:Which, by the way, I'd never noticed that until just right now.
Speaker B:And he said to him, I've been very jealous for the Lord.
Speaker B:The God of hosts, for the people of Israel, have forsaken your covenant.
Speaker B:He's just complaining.
Speaker B:And then God in verse 11 says, and he said, go out and stand on the mount before the Lord and behold, the Lord passed by and listen to all the elements that sound really similar to the different things.
Speaker B:And a great and strong wind tore through the mountains and broke it in pieces.
Speaker B:So there's just this glory and majesty and strength of the wind.
Speaker B:Lord is not in the wind.
Speaker B:And after the wind, an earthquake.
Speaker B:Remember when Moses went up, the whole mountain was trembling, right?
Speaker B:So there's an earthquake.
Speaker B:But the Lord is not in the earthquake.
Speaker B:Now, if the earthquake of fire, remember, on top of the mountain was.
Speaker B:There's fire and smoke and all that.
Speaker B:The Lord's not in the fire.
Speaker B:And after the fire, the sound of a low whisper.
Speaker B:And then God speaks to him.
Speaker B:Well, what if the low whisper is Jesus?
Speaker B:You know, he's God now revealed in his glory.
Speaker B:The ancient of days who's speaking to him, who basically says words to him like, I'm for you.
Speaker B:I'm going to take care of you, and I'm going to be.
Speaker B:I'm going to be with you.
Speaker B:Don't be afraid.
Speaker B:Now he's at the point of death, or he's like, I just want to die at this point because he thinks Jezebel is going to kill him and he's the only one left.
Speaker B:And God says, no, I'm going to be with you.
Speaker B:Take heart.
Speaker B:Well, what does Jesus do to the disciples when they're trembling and they're on the ground?
Speaker B:He says, he comes near them and he touches them and he says, arise, don't be afraid.
Speaker B:Very similar to what he does to Elijah right here in this moment.
Speaker B:And so it just seems like when you look at this, that you have this picture of an almost not identical, but a lot of the elements are identical.
Speaker B:And what happened with Moses on Mount Sinai, Mount Horeb?
Speaker B:What happens to Elijah on Mount Horeb?
Speaker B:And what happens to Peter, James and John when they're on the mount of God, whatever mount that is, and they're meeting God.
Speaker B:And so what if.
Speaker B:What if God is saying to us in Matthew 17 that I have the power to take these ancient prophets, pull them out of space in time and transfer them.
Speaker B:And in the Bible, like almost always in the Old Testament, when they encounter a God.
Speaker B:We were talking about this earlier.
Speaker B:Who's the fourth person in the fire with Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego?
Speaker B:Is that the pre incarnate Christ?
Speaker B:Is that the ancient of days?
Speaker B:Who comes, it seems to be, is the angel of the Lord.
Speaker B:Is that Christ?
Speaker B:Maybe, maybe not.
Speaker B:When Joshua is coming in and are you for us or against us?
Speaker B:He said, neither.
Speaker B:Basically, I'm above you.
Speaker B:And he bows before him and worships.
Speaker B:Was that the pre incarnate Christ, the ancient days, the glorious one who gave Jacob the limp?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Wrestled with him.
Speaker B:Who are you?
Speaker B:So it just seems to be that in the Old Testament when they meet with God, it's the second person of the Trinity, it is the glorious one, the ancient days Christ.
Speaker B:And here you have it in chapter 17, the veil is removed and they're seeing the glorious one, the ancient of days, a picture of what the pre incarnate Christ was like before he took on flesh.
Speaker B:And now Elijah and Moses are having that moment with him.
Speaker B:And there was another detail in here that I had never noticed before that really makes me double blow my mind.
Speaker B:I don't even know what to do with this.
Speaker B:But if God stands above space and time, which he does, and I believe that y' all believe that.
Speaker B:Hopefully y' all believe that.
Speaker B:Then, yeah, there's a.
Speaker B:They were there, Moses and Elijah, both of them, for 40 days and 40 nights fasting.
Speaker B:So you have in verse 8, the first kings, chapter 19, verse 8.
Speaker B:And he arose and ate and drank.
Speaker B:He was being fed by the ravens and went and the strength of that food, 40 days and 40 nights to Horeb, the mount of God.
Speaker B:So he's fasting 40 days, 40 nights.
Speaker B:You know, you go back to the book of Exodus.
Speaker B:I believe this is in chapter 34.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker B:So in Exodus 34, he's recounting again that, that Mount Sinai, Mount Horeb experience.
Speaker B:And you get to verse 27 of chapter 34 and it says, and the Lord Said to Moses, write these words.
Speaker B:For in accordance with these words, I have made a covenant with you and with Israel.
Speaker B:So he was there with the Lord 40 days and 40 nights.
Speaker B:He neither ate nor drank water.
Speaker B:And he wrote on the tablets the words of The Covenant.
Speaker B:The Ten Commandments.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So 40 days, 40 nights, no food, no drink.
Speaker B:The exact same amount of time that Elijah had.
Speaker B:No food, no drink.
Speaker B:And they're hanging with him.
Speaker B:And then, you know, the next verse, verse 29, when Moses came down from the Mount Sinai, which, by the way, is Mount Hore, with the two tablets with the testimony in his hand, he came down from the mountain.
Speaker B:Moses did not know that the skin of his face shone because he had been talking with God.
Speaker B:And what do you see in the transfiguration?
Speaker B:Glowing, ancient of days, here he is.
Speaker B:Moses comes down.
Speaker B:His face is shining because he had been talking with God.
Speaker B:And how do the people talk with God in the Old Testament?
Speaker B:It seems to be the pre incarnate glory of Christ that they meet with.
Speaker B:So I see all essentials coming together and going cajoles.
Speaker A:I think it clicked for me with that verse, honestly.
Speaker A:Yeah, like, talking with God, like, he.
Speaker A:Because in Matthew, like, he was talking with God like, you know, like Jesus, like a member of the Godhead.
Speaker A:And so it's just like, okay, I think I'm tracking now because I think before.
Speaker A:Because all of this is just very, like, why.
Speaker A:Why should we look for this?
Speaker A:Like, what's the point of.
Speaker A:Like.
Speaker A:Like, yeah, this is great.
Speaker A:Like, yeah, it's crazy.
Speaker A:Like, ooh.
Speaker A:Like, wild.
Speaker A:But, like, why?
Speaker A:Well, what's the point of, like, thinking through this?
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:You know, I'll tell you my answer after I ask Zur.
Speaker B:Well, Lee, why do you think this matters?
Speaker B:Zur, what's in your mind as you think about the nuances of you kids?
Speaker C:Well, even before all of that, I think the thing that really just shook me as you're going through verse after verse after verse is like, the thing that kept coming in my mind is like, I would never get here.
Speaker C:Like, genuinely, I would never get here.
Speaker C:Like, I knew of these stories in isolation.
Speaker C:And even when I'm spending time in my quiet time and I'm reading over passage, I might get into the details, but as soon as I go into the prophets, now, I forgot about, you know, and same thing when I'm in the Gospels.
Speaker C:And so one thing I just love that you've demonstrated is the vastness of Scripture, Old Testament, New Testament, and then to be able to draw all of these connections to Me was.
Speaker A:And I think it's meant to be joined together, because I agree.
Speaker A:I think whenever I have the bad habit, and I'm sure other people do, of, like, when we read Scripture, we read it, like, as I'm reading Matthew Chapter five today, you know, like, it's very, like, isolated.
Speaker A:But whenever you think about it and you read it as a whole, like.
Speaker A:And even just thinking about the Gospels, like, the Gospels, they often reference the Old Testament.
Speaker A:Like, they reference old Psalms, they reference stories.
Speaker A:Like, and so it's like, I.
Speaker A:You know, even the people in the Gospel, they reference the Old Testament.
Speaker A:So why would I think that I can read it apart from that, you know?
Speaker A:And so, like, reading the Bible as a whole and, like, how do they come together?
Speaker A:Because they do.
Speaker A:And so what's the point of that?
Speaker B:You know, I had this epiphany when I was in Israel with Pastor Gary, the previous Pastor Fielder, who just preached the Word.
Speaker B:That's.
Speaker B:I love it.
Speaker B:I love that we get to partner that way.
Speaker B:But he was my tour guide.
Speaker B:He'd been to Israel already, like, 20 times or something, and that was my first time.
Speaker B:And we're standing on top of Mount Carmel, and we're hearing about where Elijah had this showdown, because there is one clear highest point right there.
Speaker B:So you're like, that's one of those, like, X marks the spot.
Speaker B:It happened here.
Speaker B:Wow.
Speaker B:And like, holy moly.
Speaker B:But then he says, look out right over there.
Speaker B:You see that little village?
Speaker B:That's Nazareth.
Speaker B:That's where Jesus lived.
Speaker B:And, like, in my mind, I was like, huh?
Speaker B:I can almost throw a stone to it.
Speaker B:And it's right over the Valley of Jezreel next to Megiddo.
Speaker B:Like, all this comes, like, Book of Revelation where Jesus is.
Speaker B:The showdown with Elijah and the Prophets of Beth.
Speaker B:It's all right here.
Speaker B:And in my mind, I compartmentalize it, like, yeah, Elijah is a totally different era, yes.
Speaker B:Moses, a totally different era, yes.
Speaker B:Jesus, a totally different era.
Speaker B:But it's all, like, right there.
Speaker B:It's all interconnected, and it's close.
Speaker B:And that's the thing that, for me, I think, is the most important.
Speaker B:When I go through this, what I realize is he is the same God, yesterday, today, and forever.
Speaker B:And these details are embedded in the Word of God.
Speaker B:And I think, for me, I read the Bible every day, literally every day.
Speaker B:And I'm memorizing big chunks of it so I can, like, internalize it.
Speaker B:I have a master's degree in studying the Bible, and I do it a lot.
Speaker B:And I want to do more.
Speaker B:And I have not.
Speaker B:I'm not.
Speaker B:Like, I haven't scratched the surface of the Bible.
Speaker B:Like, even you talk about.
Speaker B:It's not.
Speaker B:Like, I read this and like, oh, I remember reading that I had to do a lot of research because I was just so intrigued.
Speaker B:I'm like, oh, okay, let me read about what happened there.
Speaker B:Read about what happened there.
Speaker B:Like, holy cow.
Speaker B:And I do some Google research and I do some commentary work and like, oh, there's a connection here and here and here and here and here.
Speaker B:And it was like one of those maps, you know, that you see when, like, somebody's trying to find a cross.
Speaker B:All the cross he's got.
Speaker B:This string connects to that thread.
Speaker A:Strings everywhere.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:It was like that was happening in the Bible.
Speaker B:Like, this connects to that, connects to that.
Speaker B:And then all of a sudden, I was like, oh, God, you are so big.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker B:Your word is so deep.
Speaker B:I love that there's so much truth here.
Speaker B:And you've been like, I almost picture God, like, smiling, going.
Speaker B:He finally big, you know.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Excited that.
Speaker B:That we would learn that His Word has so much depth and so much power.
Speaker B:And it makes me think, like, what am I going to discover tomorrow when I open up the Word of God?
Speaker B:And next month when I.
Speaker B:When I continue to read the Word of God?
Speaker B:And next year when I read the Bible through again and the next year after that again and again and again?
Speaker B:Like, what am I going to discover?
Speaker B:What new thing am I going to learn about God that's been hidden there the whole time and he's just waiting for me to discover it?
Speaker B:I think that for me, that was the most important part of this.
Speaker A:And I think, like, it reminds me of.
Speaker A:We did an episode like, a couple seasons ago, Eric.
Speaker A:We talk about, like, does theology matter for normal Christians?
Speaker A:Like, just kind of like, I'm not.
Speaker A:I'm not going to seminary.
Speaker A:Like, I don't need to know all that crap.
Speaker A:Like, what?
Speaker A:Like, doesn't matter.
Speaker A:And I think one thing that Eric said that, and I think it was he was quoting someone.
Speaker A:I don't know who he was quoting, but something about, like, the more I know about God, the less I know.
Speaker A:Like.
Speaker A:Like, when.
Speaker A:When we study and when we spend more time with God, the more I realize there are so much more of you that I have zero understanding about and zero comprehension about.
Speaker A:And I think, like, to your point, like, I think the.
Speaker A:The point isn't, like, is like, did the Lord create a multiverse by bringing, like, Moses and Elijah?
Speaker A:That's not that's not necessarily the question.
Speaker A:Like, do you believe that the Lord could do this?
Speaker A:Like, is your.
Speaker A:Is your belief that God is outside of space and time and that he is sovereign over all things, that he can do it?
Speaker A:Like, he.
Speaker A:If he really wanted to, he could.
Speaker A:Like, absolutely.
Speaker A:Like, is that where your posture is?
Speaker A:And it.
Speaker A:Like, as we were talking about this, like, I was remembering, um, there was a season where, like, there was something, like, really hard, like, happening emotionally, and I was just, like, having a really hard time wrestling with it.
Speaker A:And I remember laying in bed and I was, like, praying to the Lord, and I remember feeling such a deep sense of grief because I was, like, the only way that I will ever be able to escape this emotional pain is if it never happened.
Speaker A:If.
Speaker A:If we went back in time and made it to where this never happened, like, that's the only way I'll ever escape the pain.
Speaker A:And there was just a.
Speaker A:Such a deep grief in that.
Speaker A:Like, I know that, like, the Lord won't go back in time and change it.
Speaker A:Like, I know that.
Speaker A:And so there was just, like, such a deep grief in that.
Speaker A:And as we've been talking about that, the Lord reminded me of that memory, and he was like, do you remember when that happened?
Speaker A:Like.
Speaker A:Like what?
Speaker A:You know, now that I am outside of space and time, does that change how you remember that?
Speaker A:Because then, like, now going back, like, I think now, if I would experience.
Speaker A:If I was experiencing that exact same thing today, I think my.
Speaker A:My question wouldn't be, I know that the Lord won't do it, so this pain is never going to go away.
Speaker A:It's like the Lord is in his.
Speaker A:In his sovereignty, is choosing not to go back in time to change all of that.
Speaker A:So what is he trying to grow in me now?
Speaker A:You know what I'm saying?
Speaker A:And so, like, it gave me a new perspective on even how I view experiences and even how I view, like, sufferings and things like that, which we talk a lot about.
Speaker A:But just like, I want to have a hopeful perception of the Lord's sovereignty as opposed to a limited perception of his sovereignty.
Speaker A:You know what I mean?
Speaker B:Because for me, that's one of the biggest takeaways, too, from this, is not just an increased sense of excitement for the Word, but an increased awe of God.
Speaker B:Because, truth be told, whether this theory is right or not, and it's a theory, I have no idea.
Speaker B:I won't know till I stand before we're going to go.
Speaker B:Nope, got it wrong.
Speaker B:Oh, my bad.
Speaker B:Eris de Poncesta.
Speaker B:But what it does remind me of though, is absolutely the same God.
Speaker B:Met with Peter, James and John on the Mount of Transfiguration and met with Moses on Mount Sinai, Horeb, and met with Elijah on Mount Horeb.
Speaker B:He's the same God.
Speaker B:And he is right now in this very moment, meeting with Moses on Mount Sinai and meeting with Elijah on Mount Horeb.
Speaker B:He is right now in this very moment, meeting with Peter, James and John on the Mount of Transfiguration.
Speaker B:Because he's about time.
Speaker B:And that's.
Speaker B:My brain can't handle that.
Speaker B:But he is in the future, he is in the present, he is in the past.
Speaker B:He's doing all those at the exact same time.
Speaker B:And the infiniteness of God.
Speaker B:Every once in a while, that fire needs to be stoked a little bit in my mind so that I go, oh, God, may you increase, may I decrease, may I trust in your power and your sovereignty.
Speaker B:Not in my power and my sovereignty.
Speaker B:Because it's so easy.
Speaker B:We were praying about it this morning as a staff, confessing how easy it is to take back control and think that we can handle it better.
Speaker B:And like, how foolish is that?
Speaker B:When there's a God who is right now in the past, in the present, he's already in the future.
Speaker B:He's sitting there going, I know exactly what's.
Speaker B:I'm here right now.
Speaker B:Like, why would we not trust him?
Speaker B:Why would we not look to him?
Speaker B:So this also, you mentioned it, but the, the sovereignty and the glory and the majesty of God just elevates it for me.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker C:Literally, in this moment, I'm literally bawling.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker C:If you can't see this, I'm crying.
Speaker C:Just, I think wise because it just hit me in this moment, you, you said he is the same God, whether it was Moses, Elijah, whether it's Peter, James, John there in the transfiguration moment.
Speaker C:And if he's the same God who encounters people today.
Speaker C:Like, the thought just really, I'm just in awe the fact that that same God would want a desire to have an encounter with me.
Speaker C:And I'm like, man, who am I God?
Speaker A:Like, And I think like in scripture, you go in scripture.
Speaker A:And the first, the first scripture that came to mind is in Isaiah.
Speaker A:Whenever the Lord reveals himself to Isaiah and he's like seeing God in his throne room.
Speaker A:And like all the seraphim and the angels are like, holy, holy, holy is the Lord God Almighty and all that.
Speaker A:And he like one of the declarations that he says is like, behold, I'm a man of unclean lips.
Speaker A:And so I think there's, like, an understanding of, like, whenever I see the sovereignty and the goodness of God and I think of everything that he's done for me, like, I can't help but come to terms with my own unworthiness and sin.
Speaker A:And, like, that is just, like, such a fertile place for the Lord to do his greatest work in us because the Holy Spirit is unquenched and he's free to do everything that he wants and to point out all the areas in my life that are the least like Jesus.
Speaker A:And so I think there's a beauty that the Lord, in His kindness, like, he could leave us with that awe and that amazement of his goodness, and that would be sufficient.
Speaker A:But because he's so much better than we can understand, he convicts us and he cleanses us and refines us.
Speaker A:And I think even what you said earlier of, like, I remember as a kid, I was like, they would.
Speaker A:My pastor growing up would say, like, yeah, and the Lord's blood can cover all your sins today and tomorrow and until you die.
Speaker A:Like, the.
Speaker A:And I remember just, like, questioning that because I was always skeptic and I was like, yeah, whatever.
Speaker A:Like, he doesn't know what I'm going to do.
Speaker A:Like, you know, all that and now understanding, like, the Lord is in and out of time.
Speaker A:Like.
Speaker A:And so that reaffirms my belief that of course the blood of Jesus is sufficient because he does know all the sins that are going to be committed by me, by my children, by my children's children, you know, like, all that.
Speaker A:Like, he does genuinely know the extent of the sin of humanity.
Speaker A:And I can have even greater confirmation that the blood of Jesus is sufficient.
Speaker A:You know, I don't know.
Speaker A:It's just like, I think whenever you.
Speaker A:And again, like, I think this is.
Speaker A:We're not trying to convince you guys of, like, the theory or, you know, like, that's not.
Speaker A:That's not it.
Speaker A:I think Jason might be.
Speaker A:But, like, I think we're just trying to get you to understand, like, spend time, like, being willing to encounter God.
Speaker A:Because it's not a question of, like, if I go there, the Lord, he may encounter me.
Speaker A:He might not.
Speaker A:Like, I might have had a bad sinful day that day.
Speaker A:So he's not going to show up.
Speaker A:Like, no.
Speaker A:Like, are you willing to encounter God?
Speaker A:I think that's really the posture and the question.
Speaker B:What you said struck me as you were talking about it.
Speaker B:He's.
Speaker B:He's in my past, and he was.
Speaker B:When I was a baby.
Speaker B:He was already in my future.
Speaker B:Yeah, he knew all the worst sins I was going to commit already, and he chose me anyway.
Speaker B:Yeah, like that.
Speaker B:I can go back to when I was 17 years old and I'm in Colorado with our youth group and the youth ministers asking, what is keeping you from trusting in Christ?
Speaker B:And I realize nothing.
Speaker B:Jesus can save me from my sin.
Speaker B:He's calling me right now, and I'm ready to come, bow down.
Speaker B:And I went forward and placed my faith in Christ, and then I got baptized.
Speaker B:And in that moment, he already knew all the terrible sins that I would commit after that I had already committed before, and I would commit after it.
Speaker B:And there's some heinous sins because I'm a sinner like everybody else.
Speaker B:And he said, I choose you anyway.
Speaker B:I already know everything about you, your gravest sins, and I choose you anyway.
Speaker B:Knowing that he knows that makes that moment so much greater.
Speaker B:And also what you said just affirms it.
Speaker B:Like, if he already knows every sin I've ever committed and loves me anyway and the blood of Christ, the blood of the ancient of days hanging on the cross is enough to cover up my sins, then I should be, just like you said, zur, utterly overwhelmed.
Speaker B:Like, I can encounter you, God.
Speaker B:I can go up to the high mountain, and I don't actually have to go up to a high mountain.
Speaker B:I could just come to a place of encounter and meet with you.
Speaker B:Which is interesting because that's what God took.
Speaker B:This whole thing I shared in the sermon about a dream that I had.
Speaker B:And since the Lord was saying that he's inviting our church to change what we do on Wednesday nights, not to be a prayer gathering.
Speaker B:There's a lot of reasons for that, but I think people have a wrong view of what that is, and I think I was leading it incorrectly.
Speaker B:I think the Lord is saying, this isn't Prayer Gathering 2.0.
Speaker B:This is something brand new.
Speaker B:And I'm inviting you not to come to a prayer gathering, but to come to an encounter where you meet the same God that Moses met with that Elijah met with that Peter, James and John met with the same God that Peter as he's getting the end of his life in second Peter Chapter one, says, hey, remember when we were back on that high mountain and we saw God and heard the heavenly voice, like, he never got over it.
Speaker B:Like, we have that same opportunity every Wednesday to come encounter God.
Speaker B:And God says, I'm ready to meet with you.
Speaker B:Just gotta come.
Speaker B:And so that's what made me realize I got to Matthew 17.
Speaker B:I've got to cast this vision for the church.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, See.
Speaker C:Yeah, I have a question.
Speaker B:Yeah, I'm.
Speaker C:I'm trying to put on my Gen Z hat.
Speaker C:I'm trying to put on my.
Speaker C:You know, I talk to a lot of college students and I think a question that might come up is like, well, can't I encounter God, you know, in my car as I'm driving to school?
Speaker C:You know, can I encounter God if I just go to church on a Sunday morning?
Speaker C:Can I encounter God at the Bible study at my school?
Speaker C:Like, what makes.
Speaker C:What we're doing here on a Wednesday night, consecrating it and all that it is.
Speaker C:Why is that so important as an opportunity to encounter God?
Speaker B:Yeah, that's a great question.
Speaker B:And the answer to all your questions was yes, you can anywhere.
Speaker B:But there are unique moments when God wants to do something unusual.
Speaker B:And oftentimes in those moments, he says, come meet me here.
Speaker B:So God could have given the ten Commandments to Moses at the bottom of the mountain, you know, and said, here's.
Speaker B:I'm going to speak with you.
Speaker B:But he says, I want you to go off to the top of the mountain.
Speaker B:He could have met with Elijah when he was, he was running and he was over the.
Speaker B:In the crevice where the ravens are feeding him and just said, I'm going to talk to you here.
Speaker B:But he says, no, I want you to run the horde and I want to meet you there.
Speaker B:He could have met with all 12 disciples.
Speaker B:Peter could have confessed that you are the Christ, the Son of living God.
Speaker B:And he could have said, here's who I really am, the majestic, glorious one, the ancient of days.
Speaker B:But he didn't.
Speaker B:He said, I'm taking you three with me and I want you to come to the place of encounter.
Speaker B:And in the Bible, I mean, we rightly so can be place averse because too much emphasis was put on a place like the church was a building and you got to take off your hat and you got to dress up nice to go to the building as if that's the sacred space and not realizing Jesus is everywhere.
Speaker B:And so.
Speaker B:But sometimes we can swing, especially Gen Z, the pendulum so far the other way that we could forget that in the Bible there are all kinds of places of encounter.
Speaker B:Yeah, he had the tabernacle, which was the place where you come enter into and meet with God.
Speaker B:And it would move it from place to place to place.
Speaker B:The temple, obviously, for a season, the.
Speaker A:Mount of Transfiguration, Jacob's Ladder, like there's like significant Moments where it's like they this and then like they encountered the Lord and then they made that part sacred.
Speaker A:Like they made that location sacred.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:And I think.
Speaker B:I think if the pendulum swings to like, you know, every place is sacred, then nothing becomes sacred.
Speaker B:There are still moments when God says, I want to meet you at a time and a place and I want you to show up.
Speaker B:And that's what I think God is doing for us on Wednesday nights.
Speaker B:He's saying, yeah, you can meet me in your car.
Speaker B:Do it.
Speaker B:You can meet me in the morning, please.
Speaker B:I wake up every morning and I get up and I have a lengthy time where I'm encountering the Lord.
Speaker B:But I think there's something different when he calls the whole body together, just like they were encountering Jesus all through those three years they were with him.
Speaker B:But something different happened on the Mount of Transfiguration.
Speaker B:And I think that's what he's inviting us.
Speaker B:Something.
Speaker B:Something different that he wants to do that is going to be in a place.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And that's why all of our campuses are coming together, the whole church in one place.
Speaker B:Because then God is saying, join me 6:30 to 8:00pm in the Metro center, everybody together to come meet with me as one body.
Speaker A:And I think too, like I.
Speaker A:We mentioned this earlier, we were talking about it earlier of just like this morning in staff prayer.
Speaker A:We were all praying together and you started off by.
Speaker A:You kicked off some confession time and there was like people that were confessing and even those of us, like, I didn't confess anything out loud, but the Lord was convicting me and working in my heart and that was confessing things to the Lord.
Speaker A:And I think there is just something about getting together with the people of God that when I hear the confession, it encourages my heart and the Spirit is able to use that tenderness there to convict and to guide.
Speaker A:And so I think there's just also something about gathering with the people of God.
Speaker A:And like, Scripture talks about this.
Speaker A:Like, you know, there's even a letter, I think it's one of Paul's letters where he's like, do not forsake the gathering of the people.
Speaker A:And so, like, I think we, we are as a culture, like Americans, we're very like individualists, like, very isolating in a lot of times.
Speaker A:And I think there's just something so countercultural about gathering with people in the middle of the work week.
Speaker A:I'm exhausted.
Speaker A:I have all these things to do.
Speaker A:Like, I don't have time for this.
Speaker A:Like, there's just something so countercultural here.
Speaker A:But I think that is.
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker A:I think it's.
Speaker A:It's going to be the birthplace of something grand in people's lives in our city, you know, and.
Speaker A:And again, like, it's not.
Speaker A:It's not just happening here.
Speaker A:I think that's another cool thing that we've been able to see is like the Lord is moving across churches across the United States, and then even all around the world.
Speaker A:Like, we're hearing stories of people having these encounters with God.
Speaker A:And so this is just us as a church, like, getting to do it together and getting to worship together with the body, with our brothers and sisters next to us.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker B:There's a thought I had.
Speaker B:I've been debating about whether to share or not, but I'm gonna go ahead.
Speaker A:Here you go.
Speaker B:It second to last book of the Old Testament, the book of Zechariah, chapter 12.
Speaker B:I was doing a kind of a slow reading through the book of Zechariah.
Speaker B:I'm still actually doing a slow reading through the book, but it builds on what you said.
Speaker B:It's in verse 10, and I'm reading the ESV, but I feel like the.
Speaker B:The New American Standard Bible does a better job translating it.
Speaker B:So I'm going to do some nuances to it.
Speaker B: He says in Zechariah: Speaker B:It says a spirit, but looking at the original language, the spirit of grace.
Speaker B:And it says, please for mercy, but supplications is the also word.
Speaker B:So, like, I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem.
Speaker B:By the way, I read this after I had had my dream of water on myself and.
Speaker B:And I was reading it super slow in Hebrew, trying to get every single word.
Speaker B:And so I translated it and I will pour out like, oh, I leaned in like, what's he about to say?
Speaker B:And then when he said, on the house of David, and after hour, he's not gonna talk about the spirit.
Speaker B:And then he says the ruach.
Speaker B:The spirit.
Speaker A:The what?
Speaker B:The ruach.
Speaker B:Yeah, that's Karl Meyer.
Speaker A:Sorry.
Speaker A:That's good.
Speaker B:Jewish brethren, spirit of grace and supplications are.
Speaker B:Pleads for mercy.
Speaker B:So that.
Speaker B:And this is going to build on what you just said.
Speaker B:So that when they look on me, on whom they have pierced, they shall mourn for him as one mourns for an only child, and weep bitterly over him as one weeps over a firstborn.
Speaker B:This is, by the way, the same scripture that is Used in the New Testament when talks about they will look upon him whom they have pierced.
Speaker B:So clearly Messianic.
Speaker B:But it's saying that when we look on the one whom we've pierced and recognize that we've pierced our sins, our sins, and we weep and mourn more, what you're talking about, that's when the Spirit of God is going to be poured out upon the people of God.
Speaker B:And it's a spirit of grace and of supplications, like experiencing the grace and forgiveness and power when we pray for things a pleas for mercy and for God to move.
Speaker B:So I think.
Speaker B:I think it's saying to us.
Speaker B:I think he's saying to us because of who Christ is, the fulfillment of this prophecy, that whenever we look upon him whom we have pierced and confess our sins and we weep over our sins and we get honest and open and stop trying to put the face on and act like everything's in order and say, here's my junk and my crud.
Speaker B:Oh, God, forgive me to be the tax.
Speaker B:The tax collector, if it just beats his chest, won't even look up and says, oh, God, have mercy on me, a sinner.
Speaker B:That's when the floodgates, I think of the Spirit are going to pour upon us.
Speaker B:So I don't know what these encounter moments are going to look like.
Speaker B:I just know confession is going to be a big part of it.
Speaker A:I agree.
Speaker A:And I think it has to be.
Speaker A:I think, like, we've been listening to this series by Carrie Newhoff.
Speaker A:We can put it in the description too.
Speaker A:But he did a revival series and you had mentioned it too.
Speaker A:Um, and so we were listening to it, and on one of the episodes, he said something that really struck me that I've been really, like, chewing on the last couple days.
Speaker A:He talks about, like, how I think especially those who are already believers or already like mature, seasoned believers, they.
Speaker A:They have a tendency of exhorting more than they examine.
Speaker A:And so it's like, I see your sin because it's apart from me.
Speaker A:And so, like, you shouldn't be doing that.
Speaker A:Like this here's a scripture like.
Speaker A:And not necessarily that that's bad.
Speaker A:I think in the posture that you do it, you're exhorting your brother to be more like Christ.
Speaker A:But I think also there is a true piece of examining.
Speaker A:Like I'm like in that same scripture, like, is there something the Lord needs to examine in my heart that I haven't confessed?
Speaker A:Is there an apology I need to give someone for something that I did yesterday?
Speaker A:And Like, I.
Speaker A:And so I think there's something, too, about confession being such a big part of it.
Speaker A:Of, like.
Speaker A:And you said this, too, to staff.
Speaker A:Like, you said something about, like, if the worst thing that they say about me is that I listen to the spirit, I might be a little off my rocker, I think, is what you said.
Speaker A:Whenever I was thinking about it, I was like, if.
Speaker A:Am I okay to look a little cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs?
Speaker A:But I love Jesus and I want to be more like Jesus.
Speaker A:Like, am I okay with that?
Speaker A:And so, like, I think even too, like, pride being a big part.
Speaker A:Like, how I'm perceived is a big part.
Speaker A:But, like, I ultimately, like, I.
Speaker A:Am I living for man, or am I living for.
Speaker A:For God?
Speaker A:And so I'm like, I think a confession is just so important.
Speaker A:And, like, I. I've just been so grateful for how the Lord has been quick to reveal my sin to me.
Speaker A:And, yeah, I mean, I just think I don't want people to miss that to rush confession, because I really want to sing.
Speaker A:I really want to worship.
Speaker A:Like, I'm going to rush through this.
Speaker A:Like, no, like, wor.
Speaker A:Like, confession is just, like, such a.
Speaker A:That's something that they talked about in the series.
Speaker A:Like, confession.
Speaker A:It always starts with confession.
Speaker A:Like, and so spending time, like, truly, like, being willing to, like, if the Lord asked me to put my Bible down and go reconcile with my brother, am I willing to do that for the sake of what he wants to do in me?
Speaker A:And so I think that's also just, like, humility is also just such a key part of this.
Speaker A:And so I'm looking forward to getting wrecked by those questions.
Speaker C:Honestly.
Speaker C:Like, I mean, I love what you're saying, and I think there's.
Speaker C:For me, there's a confidence, because knowing one.
Speaker C:How you guys have led over the past few years with prayer gatherings, how confession has been such a, like, paramount point.
Speaker C:We're going to do this every time we meet, but then also getting to hear how, hey, that's also happening with encounters.
Speaker C:So maybe if you could just help me understand and help those that are listening, especially those that maybe they have been part of the prayer gathering and they're just kind of interested.
Speaker C:You mentioned there's differences.
Speaker C:It's not just a prayer gathering.
Speaker C:What are those differences?
Speaker B:Yeah, that's a great question.
Speaker B:And I don't know if I fully know the answer to that, because there's some of this where I'm going, like, all right, open hands, Lord.
Speaker B:Whatever you want to do.
Speaker B:The biggest one that I sense him Saying is that we have, I have put too much control on the prayer gatherings.
Speaker B:So I was talking to one of the staff members.
Speaker B:So when I'm leading and the campus pastors are leading the prayer gatherings, we're very loose.
Speaker B:Like, lord, whatever you want to do, switch that, strike it, move, do that.
Speaker B:But he said out there in the congregation doesn't.
Speaker B:You don't feel it.
Speaker B:It just like we just told, like, okay, do this now, do this now, do this now, do this.
Speaker B:So we're just going along with what seems like, you know, the ordained plan that you came up with earlier.
Speaker B:And I realized there's just not enough freedom for people to encounter God the way they need to.
Speaker B:And so basically it's what, you know, used to be.
Speaker B:Like, you never know what you're going to, what you're going to find when you come to the prayer gathering.
Speaker B:I think it's going to have a very similar structure every week.
Speaker B:It's going to start with a much more robust time of worship.
Speaker B:And because we're all coming together, it's going to be richer and deeper.
Speaker B:And, you know, I think there's going to be.
Speaker B:What I'm envisioning is just times where people are like on their face before God in the front, spending as much time as they need to confessing and weeping and dealing with sin or finding somebody else and confessing.
Speaker B:And we're worshiping and we're hovering in that for 20, 30 minutes, even more than we do on a Sunday morning, just able to cry out to God and to worship him and see his glory as we lift him high.
Speaker B:Then there's going to be a five to ten minute little teaching about people who encounter God in the Bible and how they walk away change just to spur us on from God's word of ways to think about encountering God.
Speaker B:And then the rest of the time, the 45 minutes to hour that's left is going to be you encounter God how you need to encounter him.
Speaker B:Wow.
Speaker B:And so we're going to start off experimenting with 10 or more prayer stations around that could be places that it's like you go as you need to.
Speaker B:We're still going to have a station which is prayer for the lost.
Speaker B:And I likely won't let us leave.
Speaker B:We've prayed for every last name every week because God is just doing too much right now for us to abandon that.
Speaker B:There's going to be, you know, might have some initial confession during worship, but there's a confession station where like we're even picturing your got a black pen and a black piece of paper, and you're writing your confession, confession on it and nailing it to a cross.
Speaker B:No one can read it, but you know the Lord can.
Speaker B:And you're just saying, I'm putting it on the cross just to.
Speaker B:Just to get that out so we no longer are.
Speaker B:There's a.
Speaker B:A big cross and there'll be kneeling pads all around him.
Speaker B:You might just spend 45 minutes on your knees before Christ and just worshiping him, being still before Him.
Speaker B:There's going to be people who can anoint you with oil and pray over you.
Speaker B:There's going to be a station where there might be readings of the Bible.
Speaker B:You just sit and read and there's going to be all in the.
Speaker B:There's a.
Speaker B:You're going to have a guide that shows you what all the prayer stations are and where they're located.
Speaker B:And then you just go and say, spirit, how do you want me to encounter you today?
Speaker B:And you just let the Lord take you place by place until we hit the end of it.
Speaker B:And I'm envisioning it this way.
Speaker B:I have no idea if it's going to work this way.
Speaker B:But if I'm looking at the names of the people, if they're not being prayed over the last 10 minutes, I might go, okay, all of our efforts over here, let's come make sure we pray for every last name.
Speaker B:But it's really just.
Speaker B:Oh, and one of the most important parts is we're going to have a couple of elders who are down front who, if you know, an elder spiritual leader of a congregation.
Speaker B:So a couple of the elders down front who are ready to receive somebody who might want to share a word with people either maybe, like me, like a dream that they sense that God is saying something, a word of insight the Lord has put on their heart, maybe even a public confession of sin that they want to share something like that that they would want to share with the group.
Speaker B:And the elders are there to filter it.
Speaker B:Yeah, to make sure.
Speaker B:Like, does.
Speaker B:Does it resonate with those elders that this is something that's worth being shared and they'll have an opportunity.
Speaker B:We'll call everybody together and with a microphone say, all right, time to share.
Speaker B:So that it's not just the person on the stage with the microphone on talking, but the spirit of God can move.
Speaker B:And it's not going to be.
Speaker B:Come here, like, imag.
Speaker B:Image magnification speaker and band.
Speaker B:Like the.
Speaker B:The band is going to be not even lit up, and we're not looking at them.
Speaker B:We're worshiping the Lord.
Speaker B:There's a big cross in the center stage.
Speaker B:The screens are turned off other than just, like, scriptures and things on there, because the focus is not any human being.
Speaker B:The focus is the Lord Jesus Christ and coming to encounter him.
Speaker B:And so it's a chance for all of us to be led by the Spirit and respond.
Speaker C:I love that last sentence that you said, because everything you're describing in my mind is to say we really are saying the same spirit of God who's in you, Jason, is the same spirit of God who's in all of us that are part of feel the church.
Speaker C:Like, every believer has the same spirit of God.
Speaker C:And these moments are opportunities to listen to the spirit.
Speaker C:Spirit of God.
Speaker C:What do you have for me?
Speaker C:Is it to go to this station?
Speaker C:To go to that station?
Speaker C:But then even, like, you mentioned, like, an opportunity to.
Speaker C:Am I hearing from the spirit?
Speaker C:Is there a word of insight and then getting an opportunity to exercise that I think is just amazing.
Speaker C:It's amazing.
Speaker B:It's powerful.
Speaker A:Yeah, I. I also kind of want to ask, like, you know, Marty and I were just talking about, you know, I think we're.
Speaker A:We're big feelers.
Speaker A:I think, specifically, like, millennials and gen zers are like, we're big on feelings.
Speaker A:Like, yeah, we're, like, super big.
Speaker A:Some of us are like, anyways, I could keep going, but all I have to say is, like, what if I am.
Speaker A:Like, I don't know if I've ever had, like, yeah, I've.
Speaker A:I've given my life to Jesus.
Speaker A:You know, I feel like I've been sealed with the Holy Spirit, but, like, I don't know if I've ever encountered Him.
Speaker A:Like, they're expecting, like, a physical manifestation or, like, an audible voice or, like, some crazy feeling inside.
Speaker A:Like, how.
Speaker A:And, you know, I think there's, like, some level to, you know, weigh what you experience, like, to the word of God of, like, is this like, honoring to Jesus?
Speaker A:Is this, you know, all that, but also challenging that to, like, sometimes the Lord speaks in a whisper, and it's not always like, the grand fire.
Speaker A:How would you recommend that people who come to this expecting something crazy and might leave somewhat disappointed, how would you temper that?
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah, that's great.
Speaker B:I think what, you hit a hammer right on the head of the nail, it is expecting God to meet with you and do whatever he wants to in you, and that may not feel good.
Speaker B:And so coming in thinking, like, yeah, I'm going to walk away feeling like a million Bucks like that's, that's me trying to control the environment and projecting on God what he must do to me.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker B:And that, that falls more in line with the health, wealth and prosperity gospel, which says like he's, he's here.
Speaker B:He's my little genie that I rub every once in a while.
Speaker B:He does what I want.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:That ain't Moses did not tell God what to do.
Speaker B:Elijah didn't tell God what to do.
Speaker B:Peter, James and John, when Peter's trying to tell him what to do, the boom.
Speaker A:Anyways.
Speaker B:And so like it's for us to come and say do whatever you want to with me.
Speaker B:I'm here to meet with you.
Speaker B:And this may hurt, but I need it.
Speaker B:Or this may feel amazing and I may have an epiphany and you know I need it.
Speaker B:Or it may just be I'm coming with this weight of my own sin or this situation going on.
Speaker B:I'm just laying it down at the cross and I leave lighter.
Speaker B:Yeah, just work, you know, so many of you worship day in and day out in a marketplace like schools and businesses and all.
Speaker B:You know, we get the privilege of working in the church.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's easier.
Speaker B:But some people do they have to worship in the public sphere because that's their life.
Speaker B:And by worship, I don't mean to sing song like Living for God.
Speaker B:And it gets exhausting to try to live for the Lord outside with.
Speaker B:With a bunch of people who don't care much for Jesus.
Speaker B:And so the comedy and lift that burden and that weight and sing with a bunch of people who love Jesus.
Speaker B:Like that idea of I came in here burdened and I left free that we can expect every single week, whatever that needs to look like, however still small voice.
Speaker B:That may be painful, it may be life giving.
Speaker B:It may be.
Speaker B:But the one thing you see again and again in the scriptures when people meet with God, sometimes it's woe is me.
Speaker B:For I'm a man of unclean lips and I live among other people with unclean lips.
Speaker B:Sometimes it's shining face and they come down with faces glowing and everywhere in between.
Speaker B:But you never ever walk away with an encounter with God the same.
Speaker B:And that's what I would want people to come with that expectation.
Speaker B:He's going to change me tonight and I'm going to keep showing up because I don't know what it's going to be this next week and the next week and the next week.
Speaker A:And I think that's the key part is I heard a message.
Speaker A:I'm Curious to hear what your thoughts are.
Speaker A:But this is when I was baby believer, and podcasts were my form of discipleship at the time.
Speaker A:But it was listening to a sermon from this pastor in Montana, and he was talking about how he's like some.
Speaker A:You know, whenever I pray or whenever I seek the Lord, sometimes he doesn't speak to me until the 20th time that I came.
Speaker A:And then sometimes it's the first time and sometimes it's the fifth time, but it's the AM.
Speaker A:I'm consistently dependent, seeking an answer, even if I don't walk away with it at that time.
Speaker A:Is that something that you feel like could happen?
Speaker A:Encounter, like at these meetings?
Speaker B:So until a really fast story that happened to me.
Speaker B:So I. I was.
Speaker B:This was maybe 15 years ago, and I was going out for my morning run, and I always.
Speaker B:I would always put on music and just.
Speaker B:And go for as before.
Speaker B:Podcasts were big things.
Speaker B:So I was just listening to music, going out for a run, and I love that time of just getting out, being by myself, and running, exercising.
Speaker B:Listen, music.
Speaker B:In this particular morning, I felt the Lord saying, no music today.
Speaker B:I want to speak to you.
Speaker B:And I thought, okay, are you sure, Lord?
Speaker B:Because I like my music.
Speaker B:Okay, but I. I want you, Lord.
Speaker B:So I didn't put my headphones on and I. I went out for my run.
Speaker B:The first five minutes, I'm like, all right, Lord, I'm ready.
Speaker B:Give it to me.
Speaker A:What opinion do you have for me?
Speaker B:Give me something big.
Speaker B:Okay, not yet.
Speaker B:Ten minutes in, God, I'm ready, Lord.
Speaker B:I'm ready.
Speaker B:I hit 20 minutes.
Speaker B:It was a 40 minute run.
Speaker B:I turn around, I come back like, you haven't spoken yet, but we got the second house.
Speaker B:God, I'm ready to hear from you.
Speaker B:30 minutes, nothing.
Speaker B:35 minutes, nothing.
Speaker B:30, 39 minutes.
Speaker B:I'm now entering into my neighborhood.
Speaker B:Nothing.
Speaker B:Like, just nothing.
Speaker B:No thought coming to my mind.
Speaker B:I'm like, God, where are you?
Speaker B:I turned the corner.
Speaker B:I've got the last 15 seconds of my run, and I'm upset.
Speaker B:Like, either I didn't hear you, Lord, or you just didn't show up like you said you were the last five seconds.
Speaker B:As I'm running up to my house, I hear as clearly as I've heard the speak ever before.
Speaker B:And he said, I just wanted you to be hungry for my voice, Basim.
Speaker B:I just wanted you to remember what it feels like to be hungry for my voice.
Speaker A:Remember what it feels like.
Speaker B:Okay, God, that's a good word.
Speaker B:And I walked away needing that slap in the fitness.
Speaker B:So I absolutely think that God does that.
Speaker B:He makes us hung.
Speaker B:But see, Even in the 35 minutes, the 39 minutes and 55 seconds, I was encountering God, I just didn't know it.
Speaker B:He was meeting with me because he's creating hunger, even angst inside me for his voice.
Speaker B:And then he brings it to me, and I hear his voice, and all he has to say is one sentence.
Speaker B:And it was a little bit like, job at the end.
Speaker B:Like, I cover my mouth in pensions and dust and ashes, because now I know.
Speaker B:And so, yeah, I think God will do that.
Speaker A:Yeah, I think that's.
Speaker A:That's also hilarious because I think also what he was doing in that, too, of those, like, 39 and 55 seconds, he was also revealing into your own expectation, like, even and even.
Speaker A:Sometimes I feel like there's been times where the Lord has done things to me similarly, where I think in that moment before he speaks, he's revealing to me my own sin.
Speaker A:Like, and so I'm, like.
Speaker A:I'm, like, sinning because I'm angry or, like, expectant or, like, you know, frustrated, whatever.
Speaker A:You know, control issues and all that.
Speaker A:And then in the last, you know, hoorah, he reveals himself, and then he's like, look at all that, homie.
Speaker A:Like, and, you know, there's.
Speaker A:There's.
Speaker A:And he doesn't do it maliciously or unkindly.
Speaker A:He does, in his kindness, to, like, show, like, how quick were you to be frustrated and question whether or not I'm willing to speak.
Speaker A:And so I think even that, too, of coming with.
Speaker A:I think it goes back to, like, come with expectation, but you don't get to decide what you.
Speaker A:What he gives you in that time.
Speaker A:Um, but, yeah, that's good.
Speaker A:Praise God.
Speaker A:Okay, do you have any final questions or thoughts?
Speaker C:I mean, let's throw it to Jason, because I know you.
Speaker C:You came with this podcast.
Speaker C:Like, man, like, I'm so excited about all these things.
Speaker C:Is there anything left on the table that you're just like, man, I gotta.
Speaker B:I gotta say this.
Speaker B:You gotta say this, Becky, you said it already.
Speaker B:And I would just highly encourage you to go back and listen to the message if you didn't hear it on October 5th.
Speaker B:Because I believe God is saying.
Speaker B:And I say this in a message, and I want to say it again.
Speaker B:I'm not inviting the church the prayer time.
Speaker B:I'm not inviting the church to encounter him.
Speaker B:I think God is inviting us to encounter him.
Speaker B:Speaking to me for the first time in my life through a dream and affirming.
Speaker B:It in so many ways with so many people so quickly made me realize that God himself is inviting us as a church to come meet him.
Speaker B:And I don't know about anybody else, but if God's inviting me, I want to show up.
Speaker B:And so if there's anything I could beg the people of God to do, those of you who are in the field of church orbit would be to show up.
Speaker B:And I say this in the message, and I want to say it again.
Speaker B:Like it.
Speaker B:To encounter God, you don't have to be good at prayer.
Speaker B:You don't have to be.
Speaker B:You just got to show up.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And come throw your expectations aside.
Speaker B:Don't come going, but what's he gonna do now with that?
Speaker B:Just come saying, God, I'm ready to meet with you.
Speaker B:Whatever you want to do with me.
Speaker B:I couldn't say that enough.
Speaker B:Beg the church.
Speaker B:I'm showing up not because this is my job.
Speaker B:It is my job, but because I want to meet with God, a God who's saying, come meet with me.
Speaker B:And so that's the biggest message I have for everybody.
Speaker B:I love that.
Speaker A:Yeah, I think, too, I'd love to hear your thoughts on.
Speaker A:You know, there's some people, I have friends that we all grew up together, and, you know, some of them, most of them, you know, I think we all strayed away from the faith.
Speaker A:And I've committed my life to the Lord since then.
Speaker A:But we've had conversations about faith before, and I think one thing that comes up is I just am too far gone, man.
Speaker A:Like, I am so busted.
Speaker A:And I've done so many terrible things.
Speaker A:Like, I am just too lost.
Speaker A:I can't encounter the Lord.
Speaker A:Like, I have to probably fast for 40 days and 40 nights, like these guys in the Bible, like, before I can show up.
Speaker A:I need to clean myself off before I come.
Speaker A:What would you say as an invitation?
Speaker A:Like, is the invitation closed off to them because of that?
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:No, that's a great question.
Speaker B:I think if you look at the encounters we've been talking about.
Speaker B:So you have Moses, who's a murderer, who can't even speak for himself, not willing to.
Speaker B:He's got to get his big brother to come help him out.
Speaker B:People grumbling against him all the time.
Speaker B:He feels like a loser as a leader, and he gets to come meet with Almighty God, feels like a failure, gets to come meet with God.
Speaker B:You got Elijah, who is literally at the point of wanting to take his own life.
Speaker B:And I have some people listening to this right now who are saying, I feel Like I shouldn't even live anymore.
Speaker B:And God met him.
Speaker B:You got Peter.
Speaker B:Remember, God's in the future, even as he's in the present.
Speaker B:So he's meeting with Peter, and he knows Peter is about to deny him three times in front of servant people.
Speaker B:And he still invites him to the place of encounter up on the mountain.
Speaker B:Like, there's just he.
Speaker B:He invites the most broken people to come meet him.
Speaker B:And I mentioned this in the sermon, but the transfiguration is to show us who dies on the cross.
Speaker B:It's not some deranged rabbi.
Speaker B:It is the ancient of days, the holiest, most pure of all entities who hangs on the cross.
Speaker B:And therefore the ancient of days.
Speaker B:Blood has the power to purify us from every single one of our iniquities and our sins and our brokenness.
Speaker B:We are the most broken, are the ones who are most invited to the banquet table because they know how much they need Jesus.
Speaker B:I didn't come for the healthy.
Speaker B:I came for the sick.
Speaker B:And it's the sick and the broken and the needy and the distraught.
Speaker B:He's saying, I want you to come meet with me.
Speaker B:I'm ready to encounter you.
Speaker B:And so my word would be to anybody who's feeling not worthy, you are exactly where you need to be to encounter the risen Lord Jesus Christ.
Speaker B:I just pray you'll come.
Speaker A:I agree.
Speaker A:And as you were talking, it reminded me of this passage.
Speaker A:Let me see if I can find the esv.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:I've never heard of this version that they just put up there.
Speaker A:But talking about the sinful woman who was forgiven, and, you know, she washes Jesus feet and she uses her hair.
Speaker A:And I'm just reminded of what Jesus said about her, is that he was like, her sins, which are many, she has been cleansed.
Speaker A:And because she has sinned so much and has been forgiven so much, she loves me like she loves much.
Speaker A:And so I think even too, like, there we.
Speaker A:I think whenever we become so aware of our brokenness, which some like the people that we were talking about a second ago, that audience, like, they're already at that step.
Speaker A:Like, you're already halfway there.
Speaker A:I think now just receive the grace that is given by the blood of Jesus whenever you repent with a humble heart, you know.
Speaker A:And so I'm like, then you are given a great.
Speaker A:A place of honor of, like.
Speaker A:Because this person has been forgiven so much, they love much.
Speaker A:And so I think that, like, the Lord is calling us.
Speaker A:That is the message of the Gospel.
Speaker A:Like, he's calling us to a place of honor as his children.
Speaker A:And you sinning much doesn't disqualify you.
Speaker A:In fact, it even greater qualifies you to be forgiven and to walk in that grace and in that calling.
Speaker A:And so I'm just super encouraged.
Speaker A:I'm just so encouraged by that that I'm fired up for encounter.
Speaker A:We would love you guys to join us.
Speaker A:So thank you so much for inviting us to be a part of this.
Speaker A:Yeah, it was so fun.
Speaker C:I actually do have one more question.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:So when's the next time we get you on the podcast?
Speaker B:Okay, let's see what crazy story is.
Speaker B:You know, I did have this idea of a podcast one day.
Speaker B:Maybe I'm ready.
Speaker B:You know, you get enough popular demand, we'll do it.
Speaker B:But I even have a name for it.
Speaker B:I already know what it is.
Speaker B:It's called the Kitchen Sink.
Speaker B:Everything plus the Kitchen Sink.
Speaker B:You know, every time I preach, you mentioned, like, every time I preach a sermon, I literally, I'm skimming off maybe the top tenth of the.
Speaker B:It's the iceberg and the whole place below, and you just get the little part above the water.
Speaker B:And there are times I was, let's go below the water and look at the bigger part of it, because there's so much truth.
Speaker B:And so, I don't know, maybe there'll be another passage, but I need more time.
Speaker B:So there we go.
Speaker A:Tag Maddie in the.
Speaker A:All right, well, thank you guys so much for watching this.
Speaker A:This has been so exciting, so fun.
Speaker A:We are super excited for Encounter, which is to come on Wednesday, and we hope to see you there.
Speaker A:Please join us, and we love you guys so much.
Speaker A:Peace out.
Speaker C:Peace.
